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Humax F2 FoxT and the extended EPG
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I'm starting this thread in response to a request from Mark (QuestionMark) in another thread of mine - "Humax F2 FOXT Software Update"
I have recently bought a Humax F2-FoxT, and am very pleased with it.
I live in Wales, and as such can receive signals from the Wenvoe transmitter, currently transmitting extended EPG information. On using the "Guide" I was initially very impressed, but on further use noticed that some future programmes previously shown were no longer showing. Programmes would appear and disappear, typically with the most future information being available for channels broadcast on the same MUX as the currently selected channel.
I found this strange, as once future programme information was downloaded it should be stored in the STBs flash memory.
I contacted Humax customer support querying the variable quantity of programme information available, and they responded the next day saying...
"Our box was designed to support the 7 Day epg but due to BBC having released their own, there are some technical issues we are addressing and we should be releasing a software update next month that should resolve these issues.
If you are able to do a software upgrade via pc we ca send you the software release earlier."
Not wanting to wait (I never have been the most patient of people!!) I replied that I would like to complete the upgrade via PC, and queried what cable I would need. There response came the next day...
"I will send you the software along witht he RS232C cable adapter. You will need to get a NULL MODEM cable but all of this will be explained in the email."
And I am now awaiting the adapter that they are sending me in the post (FREE OF CHARGE!!) and have ordered the appropriate cable.
I will let you know how I get on...
In the previous thread QuestionMark asked some specific questions...
Do you think you can share some thoughts and observations about the extended EPG?Does it support programme reservations across the full 7 days? How quickly is it available? Is it on all channels? How fast is it to scroll through?
The extended EPG will be fantastic when working properly. Reservations work right through the range of available programmes(currently only 4 days showing - I may have assumed it was 7 days incorrectly). The information appears instantly, and scrolling through the guide is smooth and quick. It is possible to jump forward/back different increments using the "time bar" (brought up by using the green button), allowing jumps of 1/2 an hour, 2 hours or 1 day. Once again there are no delays when navigating in this way, even when skipping from day to day. Not all channels show the same amount of information - more infomration is available on the channels broadcast on the currently viewed MUX, but I believe this is the chief problem the software update will be addressing.
So..... I'll let you know how I get on with the software update, and how the extended EPG behaves following the update.
Dan
I have recently bought a Humax F2-FoxT, and am very pleased with it.
I live in Wales, and as such can receive signals from the Wenvoe transmitter, currently transmitting extended EPG information. On using the "Guide" I was initially very impressed, but on further use noticed that some future programmes previously shown were no longer showing. Programmes would appear and disappear, typically with the most future information being available for channels broadcast on the same MUX as the currently selected channel.
I found this strange, as once future programme information was downloaded it should be stored in the STBs flash memory.
I contacted Humax customer support querying the variable quantity of programme information available, and they responded the next day saying...
"Our box was designed to support the 7 Day epg but due to BBC having released their own, there are some technical issues we are addressing and we should be releasing a software update next month that should resolve these issues.
If you are able to do a software upgrade via pc we ca send you the software release earlier."
Not wanting to wait (I never have been the most patient of people!!) I replied that I would like to complete the upgrade via PC, and queried what cable I would need. There response came the next day...
"I will send you the software along witht he RS232C cable adapter. You will need to get a NULL MODEM cable but all of this will be explained in the email."
And I am now awaiting the adapter that they are sending me in the post (FREE OF CHARGE!!) and have ordered the appropriate cable.
I will let you know how I get on...
In the previous thread QuestionMark asked some specific questions...
Do you think you can share some thoughts and observations about the extended EPG?Does it support programme reservations across the full 7 days? How quickly is it available? Is it on all channels? How fast is it to scroll through?
The extended EPG will be fantastic when working properly. Reservations work right through the range of available programmes(currently only 4 days showing - I may have assumed it was 7 days incorrectly). The information appears instantly, and scrolling through the guide is smooth and quick. It is possible to jump forward/back different increments using the "time bar" (brought up by using the green button), allowing jumps of 1/2 an hour, 2 hours or 1 day. Once again there are no delays when navigating in this way, even when skipping from day to day. Not all channels show the same amount of information - more infomration is available on the channels broadcast on the currently viewed MUX, but I believe this is the chief problem the software update will be addressing.
So..... I'll let you know how I get on with the software update, and how the extended EPG behaves following the update.
Dan
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Bob
FWIW, here are some further thoughts and observations.
I've been running a Humax DV-1000T (Fox-T + DVD) for a few weeks in N. Wales. This wasn't part of the full 7 day EPG trial, but I was getting about 24 hours of extended EPG.
What I've experienced is similar to Dan - i.e. a seemless extension to the now/next data, with fast scrolling, and easy programme reservation for all programmes. However, the availability of the data varies a lot with which channel/mux you are on, and how long you've been there.
As far as I can tell, the extended EPG is being broadcast by mux - i.e. if you are on BBC 1 then you'll get extended data for BBC1, BBC2 etc, but not C4. Switching to C4 will give you an extended EPG there, but not for BBC1, etc. The new data takes a minute or two to be pulled in after switching to the new Mux, and the old data seems to deteriorate.
The receiver is responsible for caching the data (i.e. storing it in RAM short term). After some enquiries I clarified that the software caching isn't compatible with the way the extended EPG is being transmitted, apparently due to revisions in the EPG. The result is that the cache loses some of the data on the untuned MUX after switching channels.
Anyway, in the last 24 hours I have read two articles which shed further light on all this.
www.IDTV.co.uk - Mediacast 2004 trade show, 25th - 27th of May - "Cabot Communications will be unveiling the new software for its seven-day Freeview Electronic Programme guide (EPG). Since Cabot supplies the majority of Freeview manufacturers with its MHEG-based interactive TV 'engine', the new system is likely to become the default solution for most of the industry in the future.." FWIW, Cabot do the s/w in the Humax boxes (amongst others).
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/article/ds14336.html - "Freeview STB maker Humax have issued a news release indicating that it expects the BBC to resume trials of an 8 day EPG service on May 5. The trial will take place in London.
Humax is somewhat worried that changes since the last trial might cause the EPG data to load slowly or not completely for its users and it is monitoring the situation. It is also planning to update its software for its STBs to take account of these changes as soon as is possible."
This all suggests to me that Cabot have been making some changes to their software and this is going to be trialed from May 5th (and probably what Dan can get from the Humax web site). Cabot then basically have nearly 3 weeks to trial it, and make any last minute tweaks before doing a formal launch at the Mediacast event. That all suggests to me that we may not see any broadcast updates to the various STBs and IDTVs until late May/early June.
Finally, there is some more info at http://www.dtg.org.uk/news/uknews/-freeview_epg_london.htm This suggests that the following products will be ready for the extended EPG trial - Humax F2 Fox / 8000 PVR (and presumably the '1000 DVD), Pace PVR / DTVA, Sony VTX D800U & iDTVs. That doesn't necessarily mean that all these run the Cabot software, but it sort of suggests as much.
Dan, we'd all love to hear your experiences with the new software!
Mark
I followed the instrictions that Humax Customer Support had sent, installed the software loader, connected up the digibox to my computer and after a very painless 3 minutes the upgrade was complete.
On switching the box off and back on, it booted up and all was well. On checking the EPG Guide only now and next info was showing, but I figured it might take a little time to populate the EPG. Howver after 10 minutes it was still only showing now and next (I did mention earlier that I'm very impatient!). So I fired off an email to Humax Customer services telling them that it was worse than before.
That was at 11.30 this morning. I hadn't looked at the guide since then, until just now... and hey presto, there it is all fully populated with 7 days worth of programming on all channels.
Everything I said in my previous post still holds true - scrolling is smooth and quick, even when jumping from one day to the next. You can reserve any programmes shown on the guide (I've already scheduled Moto GP tomorrrow lunch-time on Grandstand!) and , well it's great!!
The only minor niggle I've found thus far is that the extended programme information (shown by pressing the i button) doesn't seem complete - it seems to show the first 2 1/2 lines of text and then abruptly stop. I will contact Humax w.r.t. to get there view on this, and let you know their response.
Anyway, I'm going to play some more now.
Dan
After some more use of the 7 Day EPG I contacted Humax Customer Support with the following feedback.
1. The extended information provided on programmes appears to be cut-short (I think it is limited to approx 140 characters). This was not the case with the previous software.
2. In Menu>Preferences>Miscellaneous Settings>Display Time you can adjust the time that the infromatoin plate is shown. Changing the value of this does not appear to change the duration that the information plate is
shown for when changing channels. This was also the case with the previous software version.
3. This one is a really minor niggle, and is arguably purely down to
personal preference. When using the find command on the EPG the results appear to be sorted firstly by channel number, and secondly by time.
Only the first 100 results appear to be shown. Consequently, when searching for a reasonably common phrase (or by genre) where more than 100 results would results exist, only results from the lower number channel numbers are shown.
I would suggest that changing the order from "channel number, time" to "time, channel number" would be more intuitive, and useful for the
average user.
4. Again, when searching for programmes using the find feature,
already completed programmes can appear. Restricting search results to
programmes who's finish time is > the current time would be an improvement.
5. This one's more of a wish-list item, than a niggle - when a
scheduled programme is due to start a prompt comes up asking if you would like to watch the reserved programme. It would be very nice if this prompt also told you what the reserved programme was, ie.. Would you like to watch "Grandstand"? or whatever the programme was
6. Over time the speed of the EPG has decreased. It's not unbearable, but it would be nice if response times when scrolling etc could be improved.
====================================
On Tuesday I got the following response...
Thank you for the feedback. I should be able to get you the officially
released software in the next week that we hopefully quicken the speed of key presses. The EPG is also going to be released in London where we have an office so we can test the software more fully.
=====================================
CAN'T WAIT !!!
Your last update sounded pretty positive, though with some niggles. Did a newer software version ever get released? Any experiences?
The Thomson PVR box is now around and seems to be behaving reasonably well. It has a twin record plus playback capability, which is very attractive. However, IMO it's much too expensive at £300, especially with just a 40GB HDD. I'm still thinking of holding out for the Humax Twin, which I'm hoping should be here within the next three months. However, this Humax single box is getting mighty tempting IF the software updates support the 7 day EPG well (and fix some of the present bugs). £150 is just such a great price.
Thanks for all the detail in your updates - they're really appreciated!
Mark
The EPG is still behaving pretty well generally - always 7 days worth of programmes there. The niggles in my previous post still apply though (a bit slow [but still quite usable], extended info is cut short etc.)
I have had a couple of MHEG crashes when using BBCi teletext - both times for a longish time (15 mins or so). Out of the blue the teletext starts flickering. Everything still works - you can still navigate around the pages, exit teletext and the tv picture is fine, but any graphics flickers, including teletext, and the box's own graphics such as the information plate etc. This has only happened twice, and only since I installed the beta software. The only way to stop it is to power off the box for a few seconds - then all returns to normal.
I emailed Humax last week telling them about the MHEG crash, and used the opportunity to ask if there was a new version of the software out yet that I could try. The response was...
Thanks for the information. There may be some issues with this software as it is not an officially released version.Currently we are awaiting the release of the new MHEG 5 software (Interactive software), when this is released we will transfer it on to our models. So the next update will hopefully be around June time. I will contact you with anything I have in the future.
So, not long to wait. I also note that there is a new version of the software for the PVR8000T, so I hope the Fox update will come in early June (I'm being impatient again!!).
Dan
This is what someone inside Humax said re the twin 9000-t
"unlikely to be available until the end of the year"
The latest s/w on their website is indeed for epg issues, I am dead impressed with my 8000t and have found only a couple of minor bugs with it.
BTW the 8000t is £144-95 from qed-uk.